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Re: E-M:/ Eric Sharp on Hunting Protests

Enviro-Mich message from "Ann Frisch" <fan46@execpc.com>

David has made some good points.  But I think it suggests some joint
collaboration, rather than trying to determine which is worse: propagating
urban deer or drinking toxic orange juice.  We ought to join forces to halt
the insane corporate agenda that is pitting us against each other at the
expense of the environment and animals as well as people who are being
exploited in the production and consumption ends.

Ignoring some ideological differences, I would make the following points:

1.  Converting vegetables and grain into protein, whether rabbit, pork,
beef, fish, is not efficient and furthermore results in mountains of feces
and damage to the environment.  We can come together to eliminate the huge
hog farms that oppress the communities with their odor and environmental
pollution, the oppression to the animals and the ravaging of human bodies.

2.  The population of cats is indeed a problem for song birds, mice,
chipmunk and other animals.  We ought to be addressing the rack rape of cats
to provide  kittens for the pet stores of America.

3.  Fish and Canada Geese are a health hazard for consumers of the flesh.
Both consume toxic chemicals from lakes.  Geese feed at superfund and other
industrial sites and contain a variety of toxic chemicals.  The game
agencies have gone to great trouble to try to deny the hazard to people from
eating fish and are presently trying to deny the hazard to people eating
Canada Geese.  Fish are being propagated in open stream hatcheries with
their consequent damage to the waterways; Canada Geese are being propagated
using federal firearms taxes (which would otherwise go to general revenues
or used for fighting crime) to become living targets for hunters and revenue
bearers for the DNR .   Game agencies and their surrogate municipalities are
claiming that goose poop is a hazard.  Why then are game agencies trying to
increase the population in  proximity to our homes and parks?   It seems
patently irresponsible to assume that geese propagated in wildlife killing
"lure" fields do not fly to neighboring golf courses.   All environmental
manipulation to increase populations of waterfowl should stop, including the
huge grain fields planted to lure migratory birds for the killing seasons.

Rather than railing about the inconsistencies of people, including those who
would decry toxic chemicals in Central America, but consume  ecoli burger
and risk heart attack and diabetes as well as those who would eschew animal
flesh but enjoy the tasty fruit out of season laden with pesticides, we
should educate ourselves and others.

We need not reject the important role of commerce and products.  We can
insist that air and water be clean and that animals are not merely income

Ann Frisch, Ph.D.
PO Box 8254 Oshkosh, WI 54903
(920) 235 2185 Voice
(920) 235 2285 FAX

-----Original Message-----
From: david zaber <dzaber@gateway.net>
To: Chris Anderlik <anderlik@traverse.com>; enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
Date: Sunday, November 22, 1998 8:59 PM
Subject: Re: E-M:/ Eric Sharp on Hunting Protests

>Enviro-Mich message from "david zaber" <dzaber@gateway.net>
>Dear Hostages of the Engler Administration,
>Lets look at it another way.  Which is worse, folks who have no idea where
>their food comes from or those who kill an animal in the woods to eat?
>While I agree with the vegetarianism issue in large part, shooting a deer
>or two for food seems not to be a terrible thing. Yet, manipulating the
>woods to grow more deer under the auspices of "sound management" is simply
>BS and should be labeled as such.
>Further, one must also look at the vegetarian consumption issue.  Is it
>worse to shoot a deer or two from local woods then it is, for example,  to
>drink orange juice from Central America where the rainforests were
>destroyed to create orange groves, the soils are poisoned by nasties like
>methyl bromide, aldicarb and dibromochloropropane (DBCP) - (ask a sterile
>banana worker from El Salvador what they think of that soil fumigant), and
>the roads used to transport the product destroy natural habitats from
>Lansing to Laredo (Oh, that's the new NAFTA Highway promoted by the likes
>of Spencer "Lunch Again" Abraham and Carl "Look at my Shoes, I'm one of
>You" Levin).  And what of the farmworkers in those nations who suffer
>indescribable conditions to produce products for us, including the
>We must look at the entire circle of food production when we pick and
>choose what we do or do not eat.  I am one to think that local is likely
>better then distant when it comes to food.  But hold on a minute.  I am not
>saying that eating industrial beef (your biggest source of dietary dioxin)
>or chicken (second or third dioxin source for your convenience), or pork is
>the way to go.  We raised rabbits for years on our farm and they are
>efficient converters of plant materials to meat protein. However, for the
>vegetarians who love grapes in January, strawberries in March and apples in
>June, there is a cost to these items that is rarely if ever reflected in
>their prices at the  Safeway/A&P/FreshFields in the neighborhood megamaul
>on the side of the highway.
>So, what do we do in these cases?  First, it may be that local deer hunting
>is a good source of food for Michiganders and others, especially when it
>augments a primarily vegetarian diet without pork/beef/chicken from the
>cruelty factories popping up like cancers throughout the nation. Second,
>the ongoing contamination of our freshwater resources by anthropogenic
>pollutants continues to place a prime source of healthy fish protein out of
>the reach of those who care about adequate brain activity or their health
>(Hey Senator Abraham and Engler - how much fish DID you eat over the past
>few decades?).  And the NAFTA scam must be exposed for the transfer of
>vermin, disease, exotic species and wealth that it is.  That may go a long
>way towards stopping the destructive global food web's growth.
>A couple of other items to think about.
>1.  What about domestic cats?  They eat a billion pounds of animal protein
>a year, including lots of seafood. "Don't eat meat--Pet my Kitty" is a bit
>of a problem in my mind. (oh, and the birds they kill too)
>2.  The industrial deer farmers at the DNR must stop lying about what they
>do and the impacts of those actions.  THAT MEANS YOU LL COOL J.  Deer Range
>Improvement and other pseudoscientific "management" approaches should be
>dumped along with the trash.
>3.  Finally, what about local sources of organic and free range beef,
>chicken, pork etc.  Bringing those back by stopping the subsidies of
>massive food corporations (i.e. ConAgra, ADM) via highway construction,
>NAFTA/GATT/MAI scams and direct marketing help from the feds (wasting your
>tax dollars in more ways then one, each and every day).  I went to an
>American Farmland Trust farmers market today in D.C. and it was well worth
>it since it promotes local producers.  Hey, this may also help the four or
>five family farmers left in the country too.
>Now, back to my pork fed beef burger topped with bacon and smothered in
>cheese.  (kidding, so don't blow your aortas).
>p.s.  cheese and milk are higher on the trophic chain then meat since they
>are lactational products.  Thus, vegetarians who eat cheese, milk and other
>dairy products while eschewing meat on the basis of its input requirements
>should look twice at their cheese sandwiches.
>David John Zaber
>"I used to cry out of fear, now I cry out of knowledge"
>> From: Chris Anderlik <anderlik@traverse.com>
>> To: enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
>> Subject: E-M:/ Eric Sharp on Hunting Protests
>> Date: Sunday, November 22, 1998 12:57 PM
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Enviro-Mich message from anderlik@traverse.com (Chris Anderlik)
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To the Editor: ( Detroit Free Press)
>>         Poor Eric, his 2 columns/week aren't enough to spread his hunting
>> propaganda!  Maybe he should move up to Traverse City where 2 days in a
>> dead deer pictures in color were served up to us on the front page to
>> our breakfast.  There's something morbid about that yearly ritual.
>> something exciting about 40 protestors unselfishly trying to protect
>> innocent deer.
>>         As for animal rights people not being environmentalists---the
>> that most animal rights people are vegetarians makes them the ultimate
>> environmentalists.  The raising of meat for those big steaks and pork
>> which hunters and those who call themselves environmentalists consume is
>> one of the greatest abuses of nature.
>>        Maybe Sharp is confusing deer overpopulation with human
>> overpopulation.  After all the animals did just fine before the great
>> predator entered the scene.  Mankind has created the deer overpopulation
>> manipulation and artificial feeding.
>>         Although primarily an animal rights person, I challenge any
>> who claims to be an environmentalist to pit his record against mine in
>> environmental efforts.
>> Chris Anderlik
>> anderlik@traverse.com
>> 4 animals
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