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RE: E-M:/ RE: RE: / Meijer Orders Activist Arrested For WearingAsk Me About Ice Mountain T-Shirt



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Enviro-Mich message from Barbara Jean Madsen <bjmadsen@umich.edu>
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I'm not talking about the precise proximity of the well or other
withdrawal point--my point is that riparian rights and water rights in
Michigan are tied to property ownership.

--Barb Madsen



On Wed, 22 Oct 2003, Trigger, Grant R. wrote:

> Proximity is not the issue - the issue is whether a conflict over use exists - for example an irrigation well could impact a stream and yet not be physically next to the river - it depends on the local hydrogeological conditions - A well right next to the river might not cause a problem for the same reason.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Barbara Jean Madsen [mailto:bjmadsen@umich.edu]
> Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2003 3:56 PM
> To: Trigger, Grant R.
> Cc: joshua@americanlands.org; enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
> Subject: Re: E-M:/ RE: RE: / Meijer Orders Activist Arrested For Wearing Ask Me About Ice Mountain T-Shirt
>
>
> What if the by-far largest user does not live or own land anywhere along
> the river?
>
>
>
> On Mon, 20 Oct 2003, Trigger, Grant R. wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > The issue is policy implications on multiple uses/users of water resources. As a fisherman I do not want fisheries harmed but I am not going to tell a farmer he cannot irrigate his potatoes. I might ask the farmer to adjust his use so the fish still have good habitat - as a farmer I need to irrigate but if I can do so and avoid harm to the fisheries I should - the world is too small to take the view that any one use should be prohibited - in part because my use might be the next one prohibited - consider the conflict between recreational canoists and the Ausable fisheries specialist...
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Joshua Martin [mailto:joshua@americanlands.org]
> > Sent: Monday, October 20, 2003 3:31 PM
> > To: Trigger, Grant R.; enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
> > Subject: RE: / Meijer Orders Activist Arrested For Wearing Ask Me About Ice Mountain T-Shirt
> >
> >
> > My answer is your question is NO.  If I did have this reaction, it would
> > prove I was ignorant of the diversity in society, of the good works and hard
> > facts that organizations are putting out there, of the endless hours of
> > volunteer time of good citizens doing community education, and the fact that
> > Ice Mountain, the FBI and others are just as much a suspect in that
> > so-called "ELF" case as anybody else still.  i might check out the websites
> > on the issues and see what its all about.
> >
> > joshua martin
> >
> > note: i'm just answering Grant's agitating question.  i was not present at
> > the Meijer and don't know the details of the scenario that led to one arrest
> > in this case and am not defending the actions of any one individual.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
> > [mailto:owner-enviro-mich@great-lakes.net]On Behalf Of Trigger, Grant R.
> > Subject: E-M:/ RE: / Meijer Orders Activist Arrested For Wearing Ask Me
> > About Ice Mountain T-Shirt
> >
> >
> > I have a fundamental question - if this group of protesters were headed to
> > your home - after the media had reported the placing of a bomb at a Northern
> > Michigan location - wouldn't you call the police in advance of an announced
> > "protest" ??
> >
> > Whether the actions taken were justified I have no idea - but why would
> > anyone be surprised that the police were present and the security people
> > "hyped up"
> >
> > The legal precedent of establishing and controlling water rights is not
> > new - just consider the agreement signed last week by Secretary Norton see
> > http://pubs.bna.com/ip/BNA/den.nsf/is/a0a7q1p8b1
> >
> > This agreement defines California's "share" of the Colorado River.  The goal
> > in Michigan is how to balance competing interests - for example in the 80's
> > MUCC raised a concern about the impact of potato farmers irrigation demands
> > on the low flow rates in local streams in northern Michigan (potential
> > impact on fisheries) No reasoned policy would preclude one interest over the
> > other - but rather would focus on how to fairly allocate among the needs.
> >
> > So some perspective is warranted
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Frank Ambrose [mailto:snakeman1549@yahoo.com]
> > Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2003 9:16 PM
> > To: stopperrier@yahoogroups.com; earthfirstmichigan@greatlakes.net;
> > earthfirstalert@yahoogroups.com; enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
> > Subject: E-M:/ Meijer Orders Activist Arrested For Wearing Ask Me About Ice
> > Mountain T-Shirt
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Enviro-Mich message from Frank Ambrose <snakeman1549@yahoo.com>
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > To Help Out:
> > Call the Meijer Store and Demand that they drop the
> > charges and stop selling Ice Mountain. Their number is
> > (810) 235-2700. Ask to speak to the manager.
> >
> > For Immediate Release
> > October 18, 2003
> >
> > Meijer Orders Activist Arrested For Wearing "Ask Me
> > About Ice Mountain" T-Shirt
> >
> > Flint, MI-Today one person was arrested at a
> > demonstration at a Meijer grocery store. The
> > protesters were demanding that the company immediately
> > halt the sale of Ice Mountain brand bottle water. The
> > person entered the store wearing a t-shirt reading
> > 'ask me about Ice Mountain,' intending to talk to
> > store patrons. However, she was stopped by store
> > security, who did indeed ask her about Ice Mountain.
> > The local police had advised us that we would be able
> > to picket along the street with signs and enter the
> > store, as long as we didn't pass out handouts on
> > Meijer property.
> >
> > Two activists did make it to the Ice Mountain display
> > aisle wearing their "Ask Me about Ice Mountain"
> > t-shirts, but they were under heavy surveillance by
> > Meijer security. The guards stood on each end of the
> > aisle and provided a defacto blockade of the Ice
> > Mountain bottles.
> >
> > The protest was called to bring attention to the
> > ongoing destruction of Michigan's water systems by the
> > Nestle company, which owns Ice Mountain. Nestle pumps
> > 400 gallons a minute from a central Michigan aquifer.
> > The pumping is causing significant drops in water
> > levels in the local lakes and streams - destroying
> > spawning habitat for fish, and nesting habitat for
> > birds. In addition, some people have reported a loss
> > of well pressure.
> >
> > Not only is water extraction hurting the environment,
> > it is setting a dangerous legal precedent. Ice
> > Mountain's permit to pump and destroy is allowing
> > water to be defined as a commodity, not a natural gift
> > shared in common by all living creatures. Once water
> > is defined in this manner, international trade laws
> > prohibit local governments from enacting regulations
> > to protect it. This leaves Michigan and its precious
> > water resources very vulnerable to corporate
> > predation.
> >
> > The state gave Ice Mountain a $10 million tax break to
> > set up their operations in Mecosta County. Ice
> > Mountain pumps the water for free, and makes over $1
> > million in profits a day according to their own
> > assessments. At the same time as the state is paying
> > Nestle to take the water to sell for profit, they are
> > denying access to water to thousands across the state.
> > In Detroit alone, they shut off 40,000 homes in a year
> > over $7.5 million in missed payments.
> >
> > The protesters were at the Meijer store to demand that
> > they join the boycott of Ice Mountain and discontinue
> > its sale in their stores. They also wanted to educate
> > consumers about the choices they make and how they can
> > make a difference through conscious shopping.
> >
> > "Meijer is a Michigan-based company," said Steve
> > Jackson. "They should be concerned about how the
> > products they sell affect Michigan's environment and
> > citizens. We will not stop our actions at Meijer until
> > they stop supporting Ice Mountain. One arrest will not
> > scare us away, it will only intensify our resolve."
> >
> > Today's events transpired as follows: Two women
> > entered the store and went to the restroom to change
> > into their "Ask Me About Ice Mountain" t-shirts. As
> > they came out of the bathroom, security confronted
> > them, and a flier fell onto the floor from the coat of
> > one of the activists. She had 3 fliers in her pocket
> > (obviously not enough fliers if one had intentions of
> > leafleting inside). The security manager freaked out
> > and started yelling at the two. One of the activists
> > decided to leave because she was not prepared to get
> > arrested. The other activist argued with the security
> > guards about her right to enter the store to purchase
> > groceries. She also was not intending to get arrested,
> > but decided to make a stand. When she turned her back
> > to the security manager and started to walk into the
> > store, the manager saw the activist's t-shirt which
> > read "Ask Me About Ice Mountain" on the back. At this
> > moment, the security manager demanded the officer
> > present to arrest her. The activist was later cited
> > with trespass/creating a disturbance and disorderly
> > person. She was released on her own recognizance. Her
> > first court date is November 10 at 830 a.m. in the
> > 67th district court of Genesee county.
> >
> > It was very obvious that Meijer was planning on
> > arresting people when we came today. They had a camera
> > zeroed in on our meeting place in a neighboring
> > establishment's parking lot. They had at least two of
> > their security guards come to our pre-demonstration
> > briefing undercover, and had compelled the local
> > police department to station at least one car at the
> > store during the protest. They had two cars full of
> > security guards monitoring the legal picket we were
> > holding along the entrance thoroughfare. The security
> > was totally hyped-up. They immediately confronted
> > people who attempted to approach the police officer on
> > duty to find out what happened to the arrested
> > activist. They were told 'he doesn't want to be
> > bothered, now leave or be arrested.'
> >
> > Today's events marked a turning point for the campaign
> > to boycott Ice Mountain. It was the first time the
> > authorities have arrested activists to prevent them
> > from speaking to the public about the corporate crimes
> > that Ice Mountain is committing. It also shows how
> > aggressively Meijer protects its ability to sell what
> > ever it wants, no matter what the cost.
> >
> > See also:
> > http://www.waterissweet.org
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
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> >
> >
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> Schwartz and Cohn LLP which may be privileged,
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> The information is intended to be for the addressee
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