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Enviro-Mich message from "Link, Terry" <link@mail.lib.msu.edu>
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As a follow-up to Craig's note, historian Howard Zinn has a piece on
just that point published this week by the Progressive and available
at
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0321-20.htm
Terry Link, Director
Office of Campus Sustainability
Michigan State University
106 Olds Hall
East Lansing, MI 48824
1-517-355-1751 (Phone/fax)
link@msu.edu
www.ecofoot.msu.edu
One planet, one family, one future
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
[mailto:owner-enviro-mich@great-lakes.net] On Behalf Of harrisc
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 8:50 AM
To: 'Eric Sun'; 'enviro Mich'
Subject: E-M:/ RE: / Possible Cultural Roots that make it difficult to
reduce over-consumption?
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Enviro-Mich message from "harrisc" <Craig.Harris@ssc.msu.edu>
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it occurs to me that one way to counter the assumption and develop
awareness
would be to teach u.s. history better . . .
if the history of westward expansion and the globalization that
followed the
closing of the frontier could be taught in ways that emphasized the
costs to
indigenous peoples and their natural capital, perhaps then u.s.
consumers at
least would realize that u.s. growth has always been paid for by the
costs
of reduced well-being borne by people in other nations and societies .
. .
it is my sense that these things are not, in general, currently
covered as
part of the teaching of u.s. history . . .
cheers,
craig
craig k harris
department of sociology
michigan agricultural experiment station
national food safety and toxicology center
institute for food and agricultural standards
michigan state university
http://www.msu.edu/~harrisc/
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
[mailto:owner-enviro-mich@great-lakes.net] On Behalf Of Eric Sun
Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 1:38 PM
To: enviro Mich
Subject: E-M:/ Possible Cultural Roots that make it difficult to reduce
over-consumption?
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Enviro-Mich message from Eric Sun <esun.mba2001@ivey.ca>
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I cannot help but think that one aspect of the "There's always more
resources" assumption that makes us think that we can consume more
lies in
the history of the westward expansion from the 13 original states.
Too crowded in New York or Philly? "Go west, young man!" to greener
pastures and a new life. Over time, the lack of pressure to change
habits
because one could easily exploit virgin territory a short walk away
might
have enshrined this attititude that assumed there was plentiful
resources at
one's beck and call.
How can we counter this "Assumption of Plenty" and replace it with the
awarenss of a "Myth of Plenty"
since cirsumstances have changed (i.e., we cannot expand west
anymore...),
when the former is so ingrained in the American psyche, perhaps on an
unspoken level?
While the environmental footprint illustrates conceptually a person's
impact
on their surroundings, how can we demonstrate this in tangible,
experiential
ways that capture the attention and imagination of men and women
without
alienating them?
Eric Sun
Sidebar:
In this way the movie "Independence Day" was an environmental movie
with the
over-consumptive aliens the evil force to be fought against....
--- Roger Kuhlman <rokuhlman@yahoo.com> wrote:
Of course environmental problems in the United States are due to both
over-consumption and over-population.
Reducing over-consumption to sustainable levels is an extremely
difficult problem. America has never voluntarily reduced its
consumption in its history and the cuts in consumption required to get
to sustainable levels would be massive. Just try telling people that
their standard of living must drop steeply. They just will not do it.
On the other hand since population growth in America is 90% caused by
excessive immigration, it can be controlled. First you stop illegal
immigration entirely and then reduce legal immigration to low
pre-1965 levels of 100,000 per year. With low native birthrates, the
population will then stabilize on its own. Long-term you plan national
population policy to aim at lower human numbers in the more distant
future
(75 to 150 years out). With a smaller population base to support,
controls on consumption become less problematic.
Roger Kuhlman
Ann Arbor, Michigan
--- William Tobler <williamtobler@critterswoods.org>
wrote:
Of course it is both.
Do you really think that you are going to get Joe Public to cut his
consumption to a significant percentage?
Do you really think that this is a solution other than a short delay
of the inevitable?
----- Original Message -----
From: Jan O'Connell
To: TANYA J CABALA ; John Rohe ; Lowell Prag ; enviro Mich
Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2006 10:01 PM
Subject: Re: E-M:/ Re: Roger Kuhlman's pet peeve ...
I can certainly concur with Tanya here. The
problem with the United States, I would say is
more
with
consumption rather than population. I believe
we
have 4-5% of the world's population here in the
U.S.
and consume 24% of the world's energy.
Jan O'Connell
----- Original Message -----
From: TANYA J CABALA
To: John Rohe ; Lowell Prag ; enviro Mich
Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2006 5:03 PM
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I still believe that we need to look at population more from a
global
perspective, than strictly from our own country's perspective.
It's the
planet that has the overpopulation problem,
not
just the United States. If
we were truly serious about world overpopulation, we would be
focusing our
efforts at improving our policies relating to contraceptives in
developing
countries and greatly increasing the ability
of
women everywhere to take
control of their reproductive rates. The
majority of women in the United
States have that control in the United States and I believe that
is the
reason our birth rates have decreased.
Tanya Cabala
-----Original Message-----
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Enviro-Mich message from "John Rohe"
<john@rohemail.com>
Lowell Prag asks Roger Kuhlman: Is it
necessary
to keep posting your
predictions on population, as an appendage to other peoples
postings not
directly a thread related to your pet peeve?
It
is really getting tiresome.
Lowell, As a citizen with a concern over our legacy, I wonder
whether you
might be willing to dignify Kuhlman's pet
peeve
with your input on the
optimum level of immigration for a sub-replacement level
fertility nation,
like the United States. You might prefer to ignore Kuhlman's pet
peeve, but
the issue will not ignore you. We inhabit a planet having a net
gain of over
200,000 every day (yes, that's births minus deaths, daily). What
is the best
level of immigration for the nation today? Or, do you suggest
that we just
ignore the issue and let the foot traffic at
the
border determine this vital
issue for your children? John Rohe
Eric Sun
c: 416.832.1594
e: esun.mba2001@ivey.ca
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