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Re: E-M:/ RE: / Out of state trash/Granholm/waste incineration



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Enviro-Mich message from "The Henry's" <gehenry@chartermi.net>
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There was something in The Saginaw News today talking about Granholm and landfill gas utilization, but it is not online.

Let's not be a hostile place here. Geeze, I even had a news reporter accuse me of sending a private reply out to a list today.

Chill. This nasty weather is going to break soon.

Kathy


----- Original Message ----- From: "Alexander J. Sagady" <ajs@sagady.com>
To: "Julie Metty Bennett" <jmetty@pscinc.com>; <enviro-mich@great-lakes.net>
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 8:14 PM
Subject: RE: E-M:/ RE: / Out of state trash/Granholm/waste incineration



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Enviro-Mich message from "Alexander J. Sagady" <ajs@sagady.com>
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The two Free Press articles...

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=200770828022

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2007708290377

....don't say anything at all about landfill gas utilization.

However, they do
discuss Granholm offering up Michigan public forest lands for
energy companies. I guess we'll just burn up (or gasify) our public
forest resources for energy and fuels, producing new carbon dioxide emissions,
while we decrease the carbon sequestration implicit with our forests.....and
then call this all "renewable energy."



At 07:43 PM 08/29/2007, Julie Metty Bennett wrote:
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Enviro-Mich message from "Julie Metty Bennett" <jmetty@pscinc.com>
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Just my analysis from reading the Freep article, Alex. I am not as quick
to jump to the conclusion that the sky is falling as some.

Julie

-----Original Message-----
From: Alexander J. Sagady [mailto:ajs@sagady.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 5:28 PM
To: Julie Metty Bennett; enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
Subject: Re: E-M:/ RE: / Out of state trash/Granholm/waste incineration

Julie, how do your know that is what Granholm meant?   Most of the time
when
there is discussion of using MSW for energy and steam, it means building

MSW-fired combustion units (i.e. incinerators with energy recovery).

If you have evidence that it is landfill gas that is what Granholm
meant, then please
post it.   But also note that many landfills must already do landfill
gas recovery
under Clean Air Act regulation, so any emphasis on this as some kind of
new
visionary policy is misplaced.

Frankly, if Granholm thinks it is desirable environmental, social and
economic policy for Michigan that other states send their municipal
solid waste to Michigan and then somehow landfill gas recovery is
the bright spot for this....then that is just trying to put a pretty
face on
Michigan as everyone else's dumping ground.....Michigan as
the region's MSW pay-toilet for disposal.







At 03:02 PM 08/29/2007, Julie Metty Bennett wrote:
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Enviro-Mich message from "Julie Metty Bennett" <jmetty@pscinc.com>
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--

Sorry, my point was directed at your belief that she is supporting incineration. So I will restate:

Capturing energy from waste doesn't have to involve incineration. I
think she was talking about landfill gas recovery.

Now feel free to shift the discussion to how bad landfill gas recovery
operations are.

J


-----Original Message----- From: Alexander J. Sagady [mailto:ajs@sagady.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 1:27 PM To: Julie Metty Bennett; enviro-mich@great-lakes.net Subject: RE: / Out of state trash/Granholm/waste incineration

At 10:59 AM 08/29/2007, you wrote:
Capturing energy from waste doesn't have to involve combustion. I
think

she was talking about landfill gas recovery.

In general, landfill gas recovered from landfills is hardly ever used for pipeline gas. Almost all landfill gas recovery is used in conjunction with onsite gas fired engines for electricity
generation.

Where landfill gas contains chlorinated hydrocarbons, those same gas fired engines do generate polychlorinated dibenzo dioxins/furans.





-----Original Message-----
From: owner-enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
[mailto:owner-enviro-mich@great-lakes.net] On Behalf Of Alex J. Sagady

& Associates
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 1:20 AM
To: enviro-mich@great-lakes.net
Subject: E-M:/ Out of state trash/Granholm/waste incineration

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Enviro-Mich message from "Alex J. Sagady & Associates"
<ajs@sagady.com>
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On Michigan Public Radio Tuesday evening it was mentioned about how
Governor Granholm thinks out of state trash coming into Michigan can
be

turned into an advantage for Michigan because is can be subjected to
waste-to-energy treatment like in Sweden.

Assuming this was a correct rendition of what she said, I've really
got

to wonder about the kind of advice Granholm has been getting.

Is it possible that Granholm is/was totally oblivious to the entire
Detroit Incinerator debacle?   From the standpoint of airborne
toxicants,
trash combustion is one of the worst fuels you can use.   And the
economics of trash to energy have also been fairly disastrous for
Detroit.   Why would other states pay high tipping fees at MSW
incinerators when they can dump more cheaply in Michigan landfills?


========================================== Alex J. Sagady & Associates http://www.sagady.com

Environmental Enforcement, Permit/Technical Review, Public Policy,
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657 Spartan Avenue,  East Lansing, MI  48823
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========================================== Alex J. Sagady & Associates http://www.sagady.com

Environmental Enforcement, Permit/Technical Review, Public Policy,
Expert Witness Review and Litigation Investigation on Air, Water and
Waste/Community Environmental and Resource Protection Prospectus at:
http://www.sagady.com/sagady.pdf

657 Spartan Avenue,  East Lansing, MI  48823
(517) 332-6971; (517) 332-8987 (fax); ajs@sagady.com
==========================================


ENVIRO-MICH: Internet List and Forum for Michigan Environmental and Conservation Issues and Michigan-based Citizen Action. Archives
at
http://www.great-lakes.net/lists/enviro-mich/

Postings to:  enviro-mich@great-lakes.net      For info, send email to
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==========================================
Alex J. Sagady & Associates        http://www.sagady.com

Environmental Enforcement, Permit/Technical Review, Public Policy,
Expert Witness Review and Litigation Investigation on Air, Water and
Waste/Community Environmental and Resource Protection
Prospectus at:  http://www.sagady.com/sagady.pdf

657 Spartan Avenue,  East Lansing, MI  48823
(517) 332-6971; (517) 332-8987 (fax); ajs@sagady.com
==========================================


ENVIRO-MICH: Internet List and Forum for Michigan Environmental and Conservation Issues and Michigan-based Citizen Action. Archives at http://www.great-lakes.net/lists/enviro-mich/

Postings to: enviro-mich@great-lakes.net For info, send email to
majordomo@great-lakes.net with a one-line message body of "info enviro-mich"

========================================== Alex J. Sagady & Associates http://www.sagady.com

Environmental Enforcement, Permit/Technical Review, Public Policy,
Expert Witness Review and Litigation Investigation on Air, Water and
Waste/Community Environmental and Resource Protection
Prospectus at:  http://www.sagady.com/sagady.pdf

657 Spartan Avenue,  East Lansing, MI  48823
(517) 332-6971; (517) 332-8987 (fax); ajs@sagady.com
==========================================


============================================================== ENVIRO-MICH: Internet List and Forum for Michigan Environmental and Conservation Issues and Michigan-based Citizen Action. Archives at http://www.great-lakes.net/lists/enviro-mich/

Postings to: enviro-mich@great-lakes.net For info, send email to
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