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quick P2 starts



Mark Boylan wrote

 >I would like the group's ideas for an answer to this question. Assuming =

limited budget and resources, what are the three most effective things =
one=20
could do to show very quick Pollution Prevention  results in an =
industrial facility? Assume no=20
one in the facility has ever heard of P2, and don't worry about specific =

waste streams. "Results" could mean waste reduction, cost savings, =
reduction=20
in health risks, basic P2 education, etc. >


I think that the fastest, most cost-effective way to get a facility on =
the P2 track is to get the general manager, the production chiefs, the =
accountants and the EHS people all in one room with a big white board.  =
Then, with their input right there, map out a Total Cost of Waste (TCW) =
inventory of cost items.  If you put a simple block flow diagram of =
their basic processes across the top of the white board, starting with =
Receiving of chemicals etc, it is easy to make columns of cost items =
under each one.  Keep pushing them to complete the columns.  Then ask =
them to ID which items they can estimate, right there.  Add up =
everything they can estimate to get a first-cut TCW.  Then start =
refining it, getting them to come up with estimates for the things they =
are not sure about. =20

At this point they will probably be pretty horrified.  Every time I do =
this, the number of waste-related cost items under each block of the =
process diagram is starting to get so long it wont fit on the board.  =
And they know damn well that these are real costs and they have no idea =
what they are.  When they start to get concerned that you are actually =
on to something, then hit them hard with this:

Take your estimated rough total so far.  Say it is $50,000.  Now every =
TCW/TCA study I have ever seen shows that there are at least double the =
expected costs hidden in overhead.  So take your total and double it, =
tell them why.  They can't really argue, the previous step will have =
shown them they don't know what a lot of the costs are.  So figure =
$100k.  Then point out that an inflation rate of 10% will cause the new =
TCW to increase by 50% in five years, and environmental costs certainly =
are experiencing that kind of inflation (well maybe but you see the =
point).  Here's a handy trick:  Over 5 years, a 10% annual increase will =
amount to a total five-year cost of about 6 times your starting cost.  =
So if they are spending $100,000 a year right now, then over 5 years =
they will spend about $600,000. =20

By this time you are talking about big costs to the boss and mgmt team =
and they are really interested in finding out what you propose.  It =
should not take you more than one hour to get to this point.

This now gets even more fun!  Take that total five year cost you just =
figured.  That money is being spent on non-productive work, it does not =
create a return on investment.  So what is their expected internal rate =
of return?  Many companies say they are happy with an IRR of about 20% =
but they are lying.  They really want at least 50%.  The boss you are =
talking to knows it too.  So that $100,000 per year you figured, if it =
was invested at 50%, you would make another $50K.  But you are spending =
your money on waste instead so that is a LOSS of $50K in lost profits =
that would have accrued if you spent your money on production instead of =
garbage.  So now total it:  Figure $600K in estimated real cash costs, =
PLUS 50K x 5 yrs in lost profits for the next five years.  So that is =
$850K we are at now.  Remember we started with them thinking that their =
TCW was $50k a year?  Now we are talking about a real $850k loss that =
they WILL HAVE if they don't DO SOMETHING.

In my experience at this point you can ask the boss if he would like you =
to lead a short discussion of P2 opptys all along the process, starting =
at the farthest upstream end.  If they make products, it is helpful to =
have some at hand so you can point at aspects of their DESIGN that are =
affecting their costs.  Like why is this spray-painted if it could be =
powder-coated with no VOCs?  Or, what are your suppliers doing to find =
you less toxic ingredients, less packaging, etc. =20

All of this should not take more than 90 minutes.  Seriously!  Every =
time I have done it, now in several different countries, by the time we =
are done the boss has pointed his fingers around the room at people and =
said something like, "Find out, do something, and report to me in one =
month".  If that doesn't jumpstart a P2 program, nothing will!  They =
will come back with lots of things including some quick results like not =
doing some of the phenomenally stupid things they were just sort of =
doing.

Second idea:  do this with energy costs
Third idea:  do this with water costs

Burt Hamner



----- Original Message -----=20
   From: WasteMin@aol.com=20
   To: p2tech@great-lakes.net=20
   Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2001 8:41 AM
   Subject: Three wishes


   Hello, everyone.=20

   I would like the group's ideas for an answer to this question. =
Assuming=20
   limited budget and resources, what are the three most effective things =
one=20
   could do to show very quick P2 results in an industrial facility? =
Assume no=20
   one in the facility has ever heard of P2, and don't worry about =
specific=20
   waste streams. "Results" could mean waste reduction, cost savings, =
reduction=20
   in health risks, basic P2 education, etc.=20

   For example:=20
   - Issue a strongly supportive P2 policy statement from upper =
management.=20
   - Identify and attack the facility's most pressing waste stream, then=20
   publicize the results to show people what we mean.=20
   - Create and deliver facility-wide P2 training.=20

   I am interested in your ideas.=20

   Thanks.=20

   Mark Boylan=20
   General Manager=20
   WASTREN Inc.=20
   22 Executive Park Court=20
   Germantown  MD  20874=20
   (w) 301/540-0022=20
   (c) 301/802-1732=20
   wastemin@aol.com=20

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Mark Boylan wrote
 >I would like the group's ideas for = an answer to=20 this question. Assuming
limited budget and resources, what are the = three=20 most effective things 
one
could do to show very quick Pollution=20 Prevention  results in an 
industrial facility? Assume no
one in = the=20 facility has ever heard of P2, and don't worry about specific
waste = streams.=20 "Results" could mean waste reduction, cost savings, 
reduction
in = health=20 risks, basic P2 education, etc. >

I think that the fastest, most = cost-effective way=20 to get a facility on 
the P2 track is to get the general manager, the = production=20 chiefs, the 
accountants and the EHS people all in one room with a big = white=20 
board.  Then, with their input right there, map out a Total Cost of = 
Waste=20 (TCW) inventory of cost items.  If you put a simple block flow = 
diagram of=20 their basic processes across the top of the white board, 
starting with = Receiving=20 of chemicals etc, it is easy to make columns 
of cost items under each = one. =20 Keep pushing them to complete the 
columns.  Then ask them to ID = which items=20 they can estimate, right 
there.  Add up everything they can = estimate to get=20 a first-cut 
TCW.  Then start refining it, getting them to come up = with=20 estimates 
for the things they are not sure about.

At this point they will probably be = pretty=20 horrified.  Every time I do 
this, the number of waste-related cost = items=20 under each block of the 
process diagram is starting to get so long it = wont fit=20 on the 
board.  And they know damn well that these are real costs = and they=20 
have no idea what they are.  When they start to get concerned that = you 
are=20 actually on to something, then hit them hard with this:
Take your estimated rough total so = far.  Say=20 it is $50,000.  Now every 
TCW/TCA study I have ever seen shows that = there=20 are at least double 
the expected costs hidden in overhead.  So take = your=20 total and double 
it, tell them why.  They can't really argue, the = previous=20 step will 
have shown them they don't know what a lot of the costs = are.  So=20 
figure $100k.  Then point out that an inflation rate of 10% will = cause 
the=20 new TCW to increase by 50% in five years, and environmental costs = 
certainly are=20 experiencing that kind of inflation (well maybe but you 
see the = point). =20 Here's a handy trick:  Over 5 years, a 10% annual 
increase will = amount to a=20 total five-year cost of about 6 times your 
starting cost.  So if = they are=20 spending $100,000 a year right now, 
then over 5 years they will spend = about=20 $600,000.

By this time you are talking about big = costs to the=20 boss and mgmt team 
and they are really interested in finding out what = you=20 propose.  It 
should not take you more than one hour to get to this=20 point.

This now gets even more fun!  Take = that total=20 five year cost you just 
figured.  That money is being spent on=20 non-productive work, it does not 
create a return on investment.  So = what is=20 their expected internal 
rate of return?  Many companies say = they are=20 happy with an IRR of 
about 20% but they are lying.  They really = want at=20 least 50%.  The 
boss you are talking to knows it too.  So that = $100,000 per year you 
figured, if it was invested at 50%, you would make = another=20 $50K.  But 
you are spending your money on waste instead so that is = a LOSS=20 of $50K 
in lost profits that would have accrued if you spent your money = on=20 
production instead of garbage.  So now total it:  Figure $600K = in=20 
estimated real cash costs, PLUS 50K x 5 yrs in lost profits for the = 
next=20 five years.  So that is $850K we are at now.  Remember we = started 
with=20 them thinking that their TCW was $50k a year?  Now we are talking = 
about a=20 real $850k loss that they WILL HAVE if they don't DO = SOMETHING.

In my experience at this point you can = ask the boss=20 if he would like 
you to lead a short discussion of P2 opptys all along = the=20 process, 
starting at the farthest upstream end.  If they make = products, it=20 is 
helpful to have some at hand so you can point at aspects of their = DESIGN 
that=20 are affecting their costs.  Like why is this spray-painted if it = 
could be=20 powder-coated with no VOCs?  Or, what are your suppliers doing 
to = find you=20 less toxic ingredients, less packaging, etc.

All of this should not take more than = 90=20 minutes.  Seriously!  Every 
time I have done it, now in = several=20 different countries, by the time 
we are done the boss has pointed his = fingers=20 around the room at people 
and said something like, "Find out, do = something, and=20 report to me in 
one month".  If that doesn't jumpstart a P2 = program,=20 nothing 
will!  They will come back with lots of things including = some quick=20 
results like not doing some of the phenomenally stupid things they were = 
just=20 sort of doing.

Second idea:  do this with energy=20 costs
Third idea:  do this with water costs

Burt Hamner



----- Original Message -----
WasteMin@aol.com=20
To: <3d.htm>p2tech@great-lakes.net =
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2001 = 8:41=20 AM
Subject: Three wishes

Hello, = everyone.=20

I would like the group's ideas for an answer to this question. = Assuming
limited budget and resources, what are the three most = effective=20 things 
one
could do to show very quick P2 results in an industrial = facility? Assume no
one in the facility has ever heard of P2, and = don't=20 worry about specific
waste streams. "Results" could mean waste = reduction,=20 cost savings, 
reduction
in health risks, basic P2 education, etc.=20

For example:
- Issue a strongly supportive P2 policy = statement=20 from upper management.
- Identify and attack the facility's most = pressing=20 waste stream, then
publicize the results to show people what we = mean.=20
- Create and deliver facility-wide P2 training.

I am = interested in=20 your ideas.

Thanks.

Mark Boylan
General Manager=20
WASTREN Inc.
22 Executive Park Court
Germantown  MD=20  20874
(w) 301/540-0022
(c) 301/802-1732=20
wastemin@aol.com