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Re: SG-W:/ The archives



Dear Conan - I've had two harrassing e mails, from out county and out state, 
based on fairly innocuous things I said on the list. The out state guy 
thought I was talking about Ohio issues, so it was not only annoying but a 
waste of time, irrelevant to both of us. He was very confused about the date 
of my comments, what they referred to and where the development issue was.

I have no problem with anyone naming themselves and signing up for the list 
and participating on the list. It just seems silly to play this stuff all 
over the country for folks who have no interest in the issues involved, 
other than for purposes of harrassment. I have also had a number of my 
statements taken out of context and used for political purposes. There is 
one other lurker who is harrassing me that I won't go into.

The developers would never expose themselves this way. Let's not be naive. 
Let's assume it's all public, but at least have folks name themselves and 
sign up, understanding that your e mails can be forwarded; that's more time 
consuming for bad folks. I really don't feel comfortable that I can type my 
name into a search engine and pull up everything I've ever written to the 
list, subjecting myself to nationwide harrassment. I'd rather be harrassed 
by my friends and enemies locally. Tina

>From: "Conan Smith" <conanmec@voyager.net>
>To: "smartgrowth-washtenaw" <smartgrowth-washtenaw@great-lakes.net>
>Subject: Re: SG-W:/ The archives
>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 10:49:56 -0500
>
>As I see it, the SGW is essentially a public listserve.  Anyone can join 
>and
>anyone can check out the list of members.  One of the dilemma of an open
>forum is, of course, that others can hear and respond.  If we make the
>archives and the list private (the two go hand in hand) then we change the
>essential nature of the list.  Could someone detail any harassment or
>privacy invasions due to participation on the list?  If there aren't any as
>of yet, perhaps we should develop a policy regarding the potential problem.
>I would prefer not to restrict access to the list or its archives.  I do,
>however, want to assure that the there are only positive consequences to 
>our
>public discussion. If someone violates the general sense of propriety, then
>perhaps we will need to take action to restrict access.  Until then, let's
>presume the morals of a civil society will prevail.
>
>Conan
>
>Conan Smith
>Land Programs Director
>Michigan Environmental Council
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Woody Kellum" <lwk@engin.umich.edu>
>To: "'Jeff Surfus'" <jeffsurfus@msn.com>; "smartgrowth-washtenaw"
><smartgrowth-washtenaw@great-lakes.net>
>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 10:13 AM
>Subject: RE: SG-W:/ The archives
>
>
> > I concur with Kristen, and I'd be interested in specifics of what
> > problems people have had with outsiders accessing the archives.
> > If we can't be open about our views, than our effectiveness is
> > diminished.
> > - Woody
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Jeff Surfus [mailto:jeffsurfus@msn.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 10:13 AM
> > To: smartgrowth-washtenaw
> > Subject: Re: SG-W:/ The archives
> >
> >
> > Kirsten,
> >
> > Regarding changing the archives to remove the email addresses, it isn't
> > feasible.  Essentially our options are:
> >
> > 1) keep the archives public as is,
> > 2) make it available only to those on the list, or
> > 3) remove it altogether.
> >
> > I think option 2 is best.  I think it is a good idea to have a notice at
> > the archives page explaining that the archives are no longer publicly
> > available and explaining how to sign up.
> >
> > Jeff Surfus
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Kristen A. Gibbs" <kgibbs@umich.edu>
> > To: "smartgrowth-washtenaw" <smartgrowth-washtenaw@great-lakes.net>
> > Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 10:01 AM
> > Subject: Re: SG-W:/ The archives
> >
> >
> > > On Wed, 31 Jan 2001, Jeff Surfus wrote:
> > > > Has anyone been using the archives for any reason?  Just so you 
>know,
> > > > those who are on the list will still be able to access the archives,
> > if
> > > > needed.  I will post directions on how to do that at a later time.
> > > >
> > > > Unless I hear serious objections, I will be discontinuing the public
> > > > archives withinin the next 48 hours.
> > >
> > > I do have an objection. I don't like having my email address out there
> > for
> > > anyone to find, certainly. However, I have looked at the archives in 
>the
> > > past - and no doubt will in the future - in order to read up on what 
>had
> > > been said on different projects like Newmarket. I think it is in the
> > > public's interest that these discussions be made available, so that if 
>a
> > > student would like to write a paper on Newmarket they can access the
> > > discussion even though they are not a member. I'm sure that there are
> > > other reasons to have this resource available for non-members, whether
> > > they be journalists, students, researchers, etc.
> > >
> > > Is there a way to archive the list with our names but not our 
>addresses?
> > > That seems the wisest course to take. If this is not technologically
> > > feasible, then I would reluctantly make the archive private with 
>access
> > to
> > > members only. At least then we should make some sort of statement that
> > the
> > > archive is accessible only if you are a member with the instructions 
>on
> > > how to become one.
> > >
> > > regards,
> > >
> > > -Kristen
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ===============================================================
> > > smartgrowth-washtenaw:  Internet List and Forum for issues relating to
> > > sprawl, smart growth, and preservation of the quality of life in
> > Washtenaw
> > > County.
> > >
> > > Postings to:  smartgrowth-washtenaw@great-lakes.net      For info, 
>send
> > > email to majordomo@great-lakes.net  with a one-line message body of
> > "info
> > > smartgrowth-washtenaw"
> > > ===============================================================
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ===============================================================
> > smartgrowth-washtenaw:  Internet List and Forum for issues relating to
> > sprawl, smart growth, and preservation of the quality of life in 
>Washtenaw
> > County.
> >
> > Postings to:  smartgrowth-washtenaw@great-lakes.net      For info, send
> > email to majordomo@great-lakes.net  with a one-line message body of  
>"info
> > smartgrowth-washtenaw"
> > ===============================================================
> >
> >
> >
> > ===============================================================
> > smartgrowth-washtenaw:  Internet List and Forum for issues relating to
> > sprawl, smart growth, and preservation of the quality of life in 
>Washtenaw
> > County.
> >
> > Postings to:  smartgrowth-washtenaw@great-lakes.net      For info, send
> > email to majordomo@great-lakes.net  with a one-line message body of  
>"info
> > smartgrowth-washtenaw"
> > ===============================================================
> >
>
>
>
>
>===============================================================
>smartgrowth-washtenaw:  Internet List and Forum for issues relating to
>sprawl, smart growth, and preservation of the quality of life in Washtenaw
>County.
>
>Postings to:  smartgrowth-washtenaw@great-lakes.net      For info, send
>email to majordomo@great-lakes.net  with a one-line message body of  "info
>smartgrowth-washtenaw"
>===============================================================

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